Turbotronik NT50 killed a winding on a TMP50?

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Brian Edwards
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Turbotronik NT50 killed a winding on a TMP50?

Post by Brian Edwards » Tue Oct 17, 2017 11:42 pm

Hello all,

Newbie, here for a turbopump/controller question. I have an NT50/TMP50 combo that has been used for years. No issues. Had another NT50 so I picked up a TMP50 off ebay and began to test it with the known good NT50. Ran for hours, running fine. Left for the day, came back and the NT50 is dead. Tried the other NT50 and it is dead, probably why my old boss left it in the bottom of a cabinet. Further testing of the TMP50 yields one of the TMP50 windings appears to be gone.

My method for determining the winding issue was simply measuring resistance from each winding to ground. I've seen the helpful photos and controller notes here and wanted to ask:

1. Is my method adequate to test the state of the pump?
2. Is there a source for windings, or has anyone repaired these?
3. Is there a good source for a NT50 service manual, or is it arduino to the rescue?

Thank you for your time.

Brian

Rex Allers
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Re: Turbotronik NT50 killed a winding on a TMP50?

Post by Rex Allers » Wed Oct 18, 2017 2:55 am

bleAuct,

You are violating a few forum rules that you probably never saw.

I think you will understand if you read the whole (fairly short) thread linked below. Especially the first and last posts made by me (Rex Allers).

Topic:
Changing your Username
viewtopic.php?f=46&t=11603

I think your technical question will be better received by members if you adjust what is stated in the rules you see there.

Your choice of where to make this post is not completely off base, but please try to understand the purpose of the "New User Chat Area" too.

P.S. I will find it nice to see your cryptic pseudonym tag go away.
Rex Allers

ian_krase
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Re: Turbotronik NT50 killed a winding on a TMP50?

Post by ian_krase » Wed Oct 18, 2017 5:27 am

One possible source for windings is destroyed pumps sold on Ebay.

Jerry Biehler
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Re: Turbotronik NT50 killed a winding on a TMP50?

Post by Jerry Biehler » Wed Oct 18, 2017 6:16 am

Schematics for the NT50 on my google drive: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B1bUB ... ThpQzRvVU0

Good luck finding a crashed TMP50 on ebay. There was a time a few years ago when someone dumped a whole bunch of them for $100 a pop, I got a couple. But I have not seen any deals in a while.

You should have equal resistance between the three phases on the motor connector. If not then you have issues. It should also be open to ground. Be careful with the cables on these, they are dual shielded with one shield being at around 170v, I killed a drive finding this out.

John will probably be chiming in on these pumps too, he has has quite the sorted past with them.

John Futter
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Re: Turbotronik NT50 killed a winding on a TMP50?

Post by John Futter » Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:07 am

Most of the controllers for the TMP50
are too old and never worked as they should
usually they let the magic smoke out and die Nt 10 / 12 /13
I have never had one upset a winding in the pump --unless somone has put a higher current fuse in it

I designed a controller for these and other three phase pumps there is a link on this site to the schematic
the major dump of these pumps came around 8 years ago and I bought 14 of these for work off ebay
1 x tight one that over currented on startup the others fine and still running today 24/7/365 on our beam lines.

Never put an unknown pump to an unknown controller!!!
always test the controller first by setting up a resistor load (delta connection) and check out all phases.
Pumps check as Jerry said equal resistance winding to winding and no leakage to earth.
Looking down into top of pump turn pump 360 degrees the rotor sould stay almost still (measures how sticky bearing is)

Brian Edwards
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Re: Turbotronik NT50 killed a winding on a TMP50?

Post by Brian Edwards » Wed Oct 18, 2017 4:26 pm

Thank you for the responses.

Rex, name changed. I had searched far and wide before posting here. Will use the chat space first next time.

Ian, thank you! The pump windings are intact. Your description of the winding got me to thinking, and I found the diagram from John Waskey here and realized I had flipped the pinout. The NT50 schematic will make diagnostics much easier. I really appreciate this.

John, thank you for the controller link. I was already planning to build a controller (2 pumps, currently 2 dead controllers, chance of getting 2 working controllers approaching zero), and you have already done the hard part.

I'm really enjoying the Fusor Forums, thank you all.



-Brian

Jerry Biehler
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Re: Turbotronik NT50 killed a winding on a TMP50?

Post by Jerry Biehler » Thu Oct 19, 2017 12:08 am

The NT50 is very simple. With the schematic and waveforms plus a scope you should be able to fix them. Most ICs are socketed and nothing is custom.

Be sure to use an isolation transformer, lots of mains referenced power in there. Or use a battery powered scope.

Brian Edwards
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Re: Turbotronik NT50 killed a winding on a TMP50?

Post by Brian Edwards » Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:55 pm

Jerry,

Thanks. I will take a look at the NT50 controllers tonight.

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