Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

For the design and construction details of ion guns, necessary for more advanced designs and lower vacuums.
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

Post by Dennis P Brown » Wed Feb 22, 2017 4:18 pm

A few issues and nomenclature: first off, there is no such thing as a "self generated current". I assume you mean an induced current.

All plasma's have a velocity component - I assume you mean a plasma that you will force to have a 'net' direction by some of the ions(?) Plasma's don't induce an external magnetic field unless they have a net direction via a net current component.

A watt/power device - simply use the standard formula for power; you have current, time and voltage.

Magnetic Reconnection is a 'hot' topic in theoretical physics because it is so poorly understood. One of the few 'easy' ways to study it directly is by satellites located around the Earth. Requires very advance equipment and powerful fields to attempt in a laboratory environment. That is a tall order. Also, one needs a very strong plasma physics background to approach this subject in a realistic manner.

That all said, what you have so far explained is hardly a topic that belongs in the "Ion Gun" forum and is rather disconnected relative to fusors. Also, I still don't understand what you are trying to achieve and how it relates to the topic of fusion. Sorry, not trying to be a pain but I am really lost on this point.

Andrew Haynes
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Re: Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

Post by Andrew Haynes » Thu Feb 23, 2017 5:28 am

The picture below is what I'm trying to create over the coming months. A chemical reaction creates ionized gas flow, that goes down a electrical insulation tube, spark gap fire to keep and increase the charge density, a radial magnetic field is created that cuts at right angles to copper wire inductor.
The device might be a coil instead of straight, and maybe other arranges will show themselves further down the track.
The ionized gas will be a pulse or blob, with the theory that the electron drift velocity in one km/sec will be faster than copper.
Attachments
tmp_31515-IMG_20170223_181920-1955745111.jpg
Andrew Haynes

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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

Post by Dennis P Brown » Thu Feb 23, 2017 10:32 am

Ok; thanks. That does help clarify what you are getting at. That is a lot to achieve.

When you mean 'chemical reaction", I assume you are "burning" very small quantities of deuterium gas? If so, be extremely careful. That stuff is highly explosive in most mixtures of air and any significant accumulation can result in a very bad day.

Creating "plasma balls" is an extremely difficult art and has killed professionals so be very careful. And I have watched (but warned them not to try the experiment) as someone created such a plasma ball using a capacitor bank. They were too close and the plasma ball touched their hand. They were thrown across the room. They survived but learned a hard lesson.

Andrew Haynes
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Re: Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

Post by Andrew Haynes » Mon Feb 27, 2017 7:11 am

I've built a test rig, which I will be getting all my data from. I'll be only making small changes to it.
So far a 2.0uF bank is discharge across approx 10mm spark gap. The voltage from the multimeter which is coming from 3 turn of wire around the plastic tube, is fluctuating around 3-4mV, when the gap fires it increases to 4-6mV.
After repeated fires both measurements drop to 1-2,2-4 respectful.
I think the drop might be caused by a build up of charge inside the tube, lowering the break over voltage, making less current pulse.
Will be doing some tests with magnetic next to the spark gap, and plan to tape up the pick coil etc.
Attachments
tmp_4255-IMG_20170227_1959481233310771.jpg
tmp_4255-IMG_20170227_195932-1955745111.jpg
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Andrew Haynes
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Re: Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

Post by Andrew Haynes » Wed Mar 01, 2017 9:47 am

Increasing the cap bank made the NST pack up, built this power supply from a MOT and voltage tripler. The noise on the multimeter is belay reading but ever now and then I get a decent reading.
The multimeter takes samples about twice a second, I'm missing the spike, I will try to build this peak detector.

Cheers
Attachments
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tmp_9016-IMG_20170301_2240141233310771.jpg
tmp_9016-IMG_20170301_223409-1955745111.jpg
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Jonathan Schilling
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Re: Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

Post by Jonathan Schilling » Thu Mar 02, 2017 11:43 pm

Hi Andrew,

please do not get me wrong about the following:
I am very happy having found this forum where other people are actively working in experimental physics
and greatly encourage anybody to stay in the field and widen his/her experiences.

However, having a look at your setup reminds me in some sense of the following guys from the Ukraine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g545WaMZ4oA

Indeed, their experiments "work" as well, but please do me the favour to invest at least into some quality wiring
of all the HT capacitors and stuff. Not only for the reason of getting rid of corona discharges at every sharp edge...

Have a nice evening,
Jonathan

Andrew Haynes
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Re: Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

Post by Andrew Haynes » Fri Mar 03, 2017 1:19 pm

Ha, on the semi permanent stuff I've splash electrical tape, good to 800v. I'll probable hot glue the exposed wire when I think I'm not going to change or add to that part.

Spark gap distance = 8 mm
Inductor coil = 3.3mH
Inductor capacitor storage = 2.5nF
Capacitor bank = 2uF
Capacitor voltage = 8.8kv

Run
mV......Joules
2.5......1.56-8
0.8......1.6-9
0.2......1-10
0.2.......1-10
0.6.......9-10
1.8.......8.1-9
0.2.......1-10
0.8.......1.6-9
1.5.......5.6-9
1.6.......6.4-9

Average 1.02mV

Cheers
Andrew Haynes

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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

Post by Dennis P Brown » Fri Mar 03, 2017 2:53 pm

Again, I do not speak for the forum but frankly, I am totally lost why you are posting raw data from experiments unrelated to fusor's; worse, posting a string of data isn't what experimenter's are expected to do at sites since this isn't a data archive site; nor, for that matter, does it make the slightest sense to me relative to ion guns or what you hope to show/determine. In my opinion, you should only post research conclusions for experiments. In general, most people involved with research science, is that when they have conducted a series of experiments, they FIRST crunch the data into a properly summarized form, use this in standard or their special models and PUT IT INTO CONTEXT relative to the experiment. Then they post those conclusions.

Andrew Haynes
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Re: Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

Post by Andrew Haynes » Sat Mar 04, 2017 8:25 am

Point taken, a question, I'm basing my experiment around this formula
Fx = jy*Bz = k(Ey - vx*Bz)Bz = k*Bz^2(Ey/Bz - vs)
It's a modified lorentz force for the acceleration of plasma by current and magnetic fields. The formula gives say a result 10newtons, but it obviously doesn't move air that much, I'm assuming that the force is contained in the arc, which would explain the fact the arc wants to form as far away as possible from the magnetic.
What values would a arc be in the sense of physical size, and is there a formula that can be used to produce a approximate of size based on current,gas pressure,and length.
Thanks
Andrew Haynes

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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Plasmagun/railgun for Stelarate

Post by Dennis P Brown » Sat Mar 04, 2017 5:13 pm

Your statement about "containing" the Lorentz Force demonstrates you have no understanding of what that force means much less what you seem to be trying to achieve. The force is ONLY felt by charged particles via magnetic and electric fields hence, containment does not mean what you imply; also, air (unless ionized) will feel no net force by that mechanism. In any case, with the trivial voltage and current levels you have, all the force you will really see is the heated over pressure from the air from the arc. If you want to study the effects of the Lorentz force on plasma's, then you really need to have your system in a vacuum to get clear results.

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