fusion's and man's diffculties

It may be difficult to separate "theory" from "application," but let''s see if this helps facilitate the discussion.
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Richard Hull
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fusion's and man's diffculties

Post by Richard Hull »

Man has toyed with nuclear stuff a bit over 100 years now and has been actively using its energy for about 57 years.

The first energy came from nature's own process of decay and self-imposed dismantling of her heaviest elements. Man just had the relatively easy task of figuring out that in large concentrations, certain elements would hasten the process.

This knowledge came as early as 40 years after Becquerel first fogged his photographic plate in the late 1890s. It was a very short 7 years after this realization that the engineering was done and the first fission bomb lauched the nuclear power age.

Fusion was discovered almost coincident with fission during the early days of cyclotron and linear accelerator development. Fusion was immediately recognized as the energy supplied by stars. It was also realized that inspite of excess energy pouring out of the fusion process, the seed energy needed to produce fusion was tremendous and virutally impossible to fabricate on a large scale. So, fusion remained an oddity of nature and stellar evolution for the moment.

Man found it much easier to refine, separate or breed ultra heavy elements and isotopes and merely push two near critcal masses together, letting nature do all the work for him by undoing her own handiwork. It was found that the reaction could be done quickly for explosives. It was further discovered that controlling fission was abysmally easy. This meant that slow power could be had for pennies per Kilowatt hour. Fission was the promise of near free energy and "Atoms For Peace" was the catchword only ten years after the nuclear genie took hundreds of thousands of lives, ending a terrible war.

Fission's nasty side was one of waste product which could remain ecologically leathal for millenia.

Early on in fusion's history, an astrophysicist and astronomer by the name of Spitzer decided that fusion might make a much better alternative for future world energy needs than fission. At about the same time Edward Teller figured that it would make a great super bomb. Teller was proved correct within 4 years. Teller proved that massive fusion conditions could easily be made to exist for many millionths of a second and thus make a great and fine killing engine, far exceeding the whimpy fission devices. Atom bombs were quicklly relegated to H bomb triggers or starter devices.

Spitzer's dream of slowing the fusion process down or containing it much like its fission cousin has proved, to this day, a total impossibility. In spite of billions of the money spent in the effort, we are still only getting fraction of a second fusion reactions (JUST LIKE AN H BOMB) and destroying or ablating the fusion reactor walls in the process (JUST LIKE A MICRO H BOMB).

As always, man finds it far easier to destroy, or in a controlled manner, dismantle something (fission) than in creating or assembling something (fusion). He is not without an accomplice here........Nature, herself, smiles on destruction and resists assembly. Her established rules are; simplicity at any cost. If by accident, she has sort of overdone the job of assembly and made something too heavy, it will naturally crumble (radioactive elements). The brakes are put on too heavy an assembly process by the nature of auto disassembly (radioactivity). She is sparingly creative as well for to meld to items of the same charge into a larger item (Fusion) requires a lot of seed energy.

As far as this observer can tell, gravity is the sole force capable of doing this. Unfortunately, or fortunately as the case may be, this can only be undertaken by nature on a grand scale. (Stellar evolution) Even when it does occur, it is held at an efficiency level so abysmally small that the process (blessedly) plods along over billions of years.

The natural fusion engine, however, is so expansive and massive that even at this slow rate, quintillions of watts are produced throughout the mass per second. This supplies more usable amounts of radiant energy to possible nearby objects and seeds, fosters and advances lifeforms. This is perhaps Nature's only way of understanding itself.

Man is doing nothing un-natural in embracing fission, for it is easy to impliment, easy to control and readily at hand. Nature blesses, smiles upon, and abets his efforts here.

The more un-natural act may be in attempting to assemble microstars here on earth, when nature resists this effort even in her own domain. Nature is giving man no asisstance here at all, but instead thwarting his every effort at every turn. But, nature may have outsmarted herself! For out of the ooze came cogent forms capable of performing, enjoying and perfecting many un-natural acts. She made lifeforms capable of irrational and abberant, un-natural behavior.

Perhaps, just perhaps, these lifeforms might be able to do things nature resists outright, but on a subnanoscale. It seems these lifeforms are just not content with the free, but limited fusion energy nature is beaming in as radiant energy from the nearest star. And, for some strange reason, these lifeforms seem to wish to cast aside huge stores of abundant disassembly energy she has left at their feet, insitu.

Perhaps, just perhaps, they may sense it is an all too easy energy which nature left to do away with intelligent, but careless lifeforms.

Time will tell.

Fission is a ready and usable gift of nature and a double edged sword. Fusion appears to have only a single edge, but is as yet not in hand, with little hope of acquistion in sight.

What I have attempted here is a short story of why fission is easy and why fusion is hard not just based on the physical and theoretical facts, but on a deeper understanding of nature. Sometimes we forget "the nature of things", feeling we can do anything. The question remains... CAN WE do anything? We certainly seem to have an impressive record for wringling our way past natural obstacles. Just how big an obstacle can we clear? Can the spirit of man overcome the nature of man. We seem to go through bouts of endomitable spirit and accomplishment lifting us ever upward followed by crushing examples of our real nature reminding us just how much of a harsh takmaster nature is acting through our own nature. Somehow, that which is natural or "of nature" has come to be considered all good and sunshine, when actually it is an a mix of sweet goodness and unbelievable horrors. The old Greek and Roman polytheism was surely based on gods representing the many observed faces of NATURE.

It may be best to remember that even nature has established limits and many facets. Should we be any different?

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
Tom Dressel
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Re: fusion's and man's diffculties

Post by Tom Dressel »

Richard, what happened to all the enthusiasm you had for solid state fusion (cold fusion) that you had a few months ago?

Tom Dressel
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Re: fusion's and man's diffculties

Post by guest »

The price wasn't right.
Palladium is pretty expensive.
Worse still if it didn't pan out... it wouldn't even be good jewelry.
It would take a group effort to get enough for a trial.
I'm afraid I don't have three grand just lying around to try it out. Also what if the group made a booboo in the neutron metrology? I think Richard is very wise to at least let one other reseacher do it first. Solid state fusion requires too expensive materials to experiment freely. Fusor on the other hand althought it needs expensive support equipment , the basic process is pretty cheap. You can reuse all the support equipment
for other projects but I don't have another use for palladium. Do You?

Larry Leins
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eelcasio
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Re: fusion's and man's diffculties

Post by eelcasio »

So all we have to do is create man made gravity waves with as little energy as possible. If we do that it will solve the fusion problem and the distance between stars problem. Any one ever read: "The Capacitance Theory of Gravity" by Morton Spears? His theory is that capacitance is in fact gravity. Shows links between the big (galaxies) and small (particles, something quantum mechanics hasn't been able to do. It seems to fit well in general realitivity also. The book isn't availablem by the normal circles... I had to contact the author directly to get a copy. We made a deal... Everyone remember that old Lost Science book which inspired alot of us. There's a guy in there Thomas Brown. I sent alot of my info on the guy to the author. In exchange he gave me two books and two papers he published privately....

Lee
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Re: fusion's and man's diffculties

Post by Richard Hull »

Re: tom's query about my cold fusion thoughts. No, I have not given up on the cold fusion concept. The merits are many but the experimental evidence is still moving forward. Gotta' take a wait and see on that one. The confinement times are effectively infinite, the ranges very short and the methodology might even suprise all of us.....first if the concept is real and second if someone really explains it in a good scientific manner if it is. I am not so sure that neutrons will even appear. There is most likely none to count if cold fusion happens in the manner generally associated with it.

There was a flurry of neutron counts reported in the early literature, but that has gone away for the most part and only the energy signature and transformation information is currently considered as indicators. IMHO Bockris (now retired) and his group at Texas A&M have done some of the most interesting work.

I also can't see CF making usable long term energy contributions. It will most likely, if real, just upset the entire structure of modern physics.

Also, Paladium isn't all that expensive either (~$500.00 per troy ounce) The average Pons-Fleishman cell uses less than 1/8 oz. The hassle is in getting it in wire form. Wire is one of the most expensive forms to obtain any element in and often, in the platinum group, a 500% jackup on the wieght for wire form is common. I note the current price for 50cm of .020" Pd wire is $140.00 This is about 1.1 grams which would be about $15.00 worth of metal...HMMM....try 900% markup. It could truly be self drawn through a homemade die as the stuff is quite soft. Where there is a will, there is a way. I have sold out of all of my palladium wire with most of it going to would-be cold fusion experimenters.

Finally, a lot of folks are working with nickel and titanium now instead of Paladium. Much cheaper.

As stated many, many times on this and previous forums, I am here for the pure science, learning and the experiment. I never, ever set out to power the world with fusion and am caring less and less about it with each passing day.

I currently view fission as the only on line, ready to work future energy source, short term.

I view the best and truest form of FREE ENERGY currently available to man as hydroelectric BAR NONE. LET GRAVITY AND THE SUN DO THE WORK! IT'LL RAIN FOREVER!

The rather namby pamby concerns about damming up every single water way in the US will pale in comparison to future energy short falls.

Hydroelectric power is gravito-fusion energy in its most pure and blessed form. The nearest fusion source, the sun, puts billions of watts into heating the atmosphere which evaporates standing ground water, this rises with the ground heating to form in clouds and falls back to earth on the highlands. As it runs down to reservoirs at dams, the force of gravity propelling it down huge shafts turns turbines and presto, clean, non polluting energy. Initial costs are high at installation, but other than for maintanence, the plant is good in perpetuity. All energy is free, clean and restorative in nature.

We must remember that coporate types and their minions, the bean counters, run this world....not good intentions, not the right thing to do, not even that which is convenient or expedient, safe or wise. Only that which increases the bottom line is of any concern to power/energy brokers.

Infrastructure will be used until it is too costly to maintain or the public won't buy from it anymore. No form of energy will be considered unless the cost vs. return is superb and if it demands a new infrastructure to make deliver and distribute, it is far, far less attractive. The deal is...we don't wanna' invest nothin'....We want to use existing facilities, preferably with no or little modification and gotta' have 25% minimum return or get the hell outta' this board room.

I can't see this mentality changing in the next 100 years, if ever.

Only a mindless, fierce rabble in the street looking for someone's ass to kick will get the coporate types to consider that which is right and good and sensible. They realize full well that as long as there is TV, Sunday football, TV dinners, beer and employment that the most dangerous types are safely satiated.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
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