Vaccum Leak Testing / Technique and Power Supply Question
-
- Posts: 15
- Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:09 am
- Real name: Taylor Shead
Re: Vaccum Leak Testing / Technique and Power Supply Question
Okay, here's where we are at.
The TC gauge is good. We got it tested on another pump at school.
I believe the pump is either bad or needs some tuning (this is the first time I've operated a vacuum pump so I know not so much about that)
Video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojFnM92hR9o
The hole in the top of the pump is where the air-oil separator should go but this one does not have one. I don't see it being a huge issue.
As far as power supply - I believe we have one that can do reversed polarity at proper power levels now. More later.
In other news the fusor body is coming together.
Test fit w/o insulator:
The TC gauge is good. We got it tested on another pump at school.
I believe the pump is either bad or needs some tuning (this is the first time I've operated a vacuum pump so I know not so much about that)
Video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojFnM92hR9o
The hole in the top of the pump is where the air-oil separator should go but this one does not have one. I don't see it being a huge issue.
As far as power supply - I believe we have one that can do reversed polarity at proper power levels now. More later.
In other news the fusor body is coming together.
Test fit w/o insulator:
-
- Posts: 1848
- Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 10:29 pm
- Real name: John Futter
- Contact:
Re: Vaccum Leak Testing / Technique and Power Supply Question
your short video shows that the pump is not reaching its base vacuum
ie you have a leak
the leak is so bad that using alcohol will not help
you hear that noise of gurgling at the end of your video
that should stop and the pump should become like between the gurgles
you need to fix this before going any further!!!!!
ie you have a leak
the leak is so bad that using alcohol will not help
you hear that noise of gurgling at the end of your video
that should stop and the pump should become like between the gurgles
you need to fix this before going any further!!!!!
-
- Posts: 15
- Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:09 am
- Real name: Taylor Shead
Re: Vaccum Leak Testing / Technique and Power Supply Question
I don't think there is a leak as this same setup was tested on another pump without any error or leak.
I think it is the actual pump with the problem.
I think it is the actual pump with the problem.
What do you mean by this exactly?John Futter wrote:that should stop and the pump should become like between the gurgles
-
- Posts: 1848
- Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 10:29 pm
- Real name: John Futter
- Contact:
Re: Vaccum Leak Testing / Technique and Power Supply Question
Quiet
just a hum from the running motor
just a hum from the running motor
-
- Posts: 228
- Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 1:56 am
- Real name: Peter Schmelcher
Re: Vaccum Leak Testing / Technique and Power Supply Question
I believe the gurgling sound in the video is cavitation in the oil which is normal but only when the gas ballast is open or if you have a large leak.
The oil reservoir screw cap probably has an o ring and should be closed when you are trouble shooting the vacuum pump.
https://vacaero.com/information-resourc ... pumps.html
If the pump was ever topped up with a clean good looking non-vacuum pump oil you will be measuring the vapor pressure of the added oil until the pump is flushed clean and filled with new vacuum pump oil.
Dow Corning industrial Molykote compressor and vacuum pump oils are locally available, shop industrial supply companies, but from memory a 5 gallon pail 5 years ago including delivery by UPS was about $150. The reason I dug deep into vacuum oils is because the oil specified for my Edwards vacuum pump was obsolete as was the recommended replacement oil. I contacted Dow for the additional unpublished technical information below.
MOLYKOTE L-0610 Vacuum Pump Oil Vapor Pressure:
mm Hg (ASTM D323)
100°F 4.0x10-5
150°F 1.3x10-4
200°F 1.5x10-4
These types of oils are vacuum distilled and you can purchase a lower vapor pressure grade, Dow just processes the oil more which adds to the cost.
Best of luck
-Peter
The oil reservoir screw cap probably has an o ring and should be closed when you are trouble shooting the vacuum pump.
https://vacaero.com/information-resourc ... pumps.html
If the pump was ever topped up with a clean good looking non-vacuum pump oil you will be measuring the vapor pressure of the added oil until the pump is flushed clean and filled with new vacuum pump oil.
Dow Corning industrial Molykote compressor and vacuum pump oils are locally available, shop industrial supply companies, but from memory a 5 gallon pail 5 years ago including delivery by UPS was about $150. The reason I dug deep into vacuum oils is because the oil specified for my Edwards vacuum pump was obsolete as was the recommended replacement oil. I contacted Dow for the additional unpublished technical information below.
MOLYKOTE L-0610 Vacuum Pump Oil Vapor Pressure:
mm Hg (ASTM D323)
100°F 4.0x10-5
150°F 1.3x10-4
200°F 1.5x10-4
These types of oils are vacuum distilled and you can purchase a lower vapor pressure grade, Dow just processes the oil more which adds to the cost.
Best of luck
-Peter
Re: Vaccum Leak Testing / Technique and Power Supply Question
I'm a little worried about those conflat flanges -- it looks like there isn't much space between the weld bead and the knife edge part.
As with the other people: It looks like there is a big leak in your setup. Actually, I'm a bit surprised it got as low as 200 microns -- perhaps the gauge is wrong as others have said.
You may be overthinking the vacuum pump oil question. Car parts stores sell vacuum pump oil since rotary vane vacuum pumps are used to service air conditioners. Or you can buy a 1-gallon jug for a pretty reasonable price (about 25 bucks)
As with the other people: It looks like there is a big leak in your setup. Actually, I'm a bit surprised it got as low as 200 microns -- perhaps the gauge is wrong as others have said.
You may be overthinking the vacuum pump oil question. Car parts stores sell vacuum pump oil since rotary vane vacuum pumps are used to service air conditioners. Or you can buy a 1-gallon jug for a pretty reasonable price (about 25 bucks)
-
- Posts: 148
- Joined: Thu May 12, 2011 11:25 pm
- Real name: Bruce Meagher
- Location: San Diego
Re: Vaccum Leak Testing / Technique and Power Supply Question
Ian,
I think you’re giving incorrect advice on vacuum pump oil. Look at the experiment Tyler ran to see why typical A/C vacuum oil is a poor choice
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=12189&p=80054&hilit=Tyler#p80054
I'd recommend ballasting the pump for a couple hours with the inlet blanked off. Then rerun a quick pump down test to see if there is any improvement. Also, I would not have the T/C gauge looking directly into the inlet port. Have a 90 degree bend at a minimum so you don't foul your gauge. You should also double check the inlet flange is tight the pump. I'd inspect the o-ring on the underside of the inlet flange too. If no improvement replace the oil and retest.
Bruce
I think you’re giving incorrect advice on vacuum pump oil. Look at the experiment Tyler ran to see why typical A/C vacuum oil is a poor choice
viewtopic.php?f=10&t=12189&p=80054&hilit=Tyler#p80054
I'd recommend ballasting the pump for a couple hours with the inlet blanked off. Then rerun a quick pump down test to see if there is any improvement. Also, I would not have the T/C gauge looking directly into the inlet port. Have a 90 degree bend at a minimum so you don't foul your gauge. You should also double check the inlet flange is tight the pump. I'd inspect the o-ring on the underside of the inlet flange too. If no improvement replace the oil and retest.
Bruce
- Ben_Barnett
- Posts: 24
- Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2018 5:06 pm
- Real name: Ben Barnett
Re: Vaccum Leak Testing / Technique and Power Supply Question
UPDATE:
We procured another pump (short on time) and pulled a solid vacuum of around 10-15 mTorr w/ pump on on our whole system.
Pump off, valve closed, slow leak up to about 200 mTorr, but at least now we have vacuum.
We procured another pump (short on time) and pulled a solid vacuum of around 10-15 mTorr w/ pump on on our whole system.
Pump off, valve closed, slow leak up to about 200 mTorr, but at least now we have vacuum.
- Dennis P Brown
- Posts: 3159
- Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 10:46 am
- Real name: Dennis Brown
Re: Vaccum Leak Testing / Technique and Power Supply Question
A 'leak' up to 200 microns (assuming that takes a few minutes) is mostly normal out gasing from the walls. Sounds like your system is fairly tight.